Beer Pong Forums: Bigger sized cups??

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Bigger sized cups??

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cjmcka Joined: 07.19.2008 Age: 25 Total Games: 38 W/L %: 63.16 Avg CD: 0.08 Full Stats	Posted: Sep 8th 2010, 09:36 am Post subject: Bigger sized cups?? Randomness benefits the less skilled. Essentially, making a game easier benefits good players more than it benefits poor players. Whereas making the game harder hurts good players more than it hurts poor players. Ex: If you were to make the cups even smaller, say 8 oz cups, even the good players would have a really hard time hitting them, such that making a cup would take a lot more luck. The higher the amount of luck you need, the less skill really comes into play. Hence, a pong game with 8oz cups would put elite and casual players on a more even playing field. (not to say the elites wouldn't still win) So, if you make the cups bigger, you are making the game less random by making it easier, thereby benefiting elite players more than poor or casual players. Last edited on Sep 8th 2010, 09:37 am
TheDang Joined: 04.05.2010 Age: 22 Total Games: 207 W/L %: 59.9 Avg CD: 0.53 Full Stats	Posted: Sep 8th 2010, 10:48 am Post subject: Bigger sized cups?? "Clawless" I don't think you understand that when you make the game easier for casual players, you also make it easier for elite players. If you went 6-6 with WSOBP cups, you would go 6-6 again with solo cups. Example (since you love them so much): You play against a good team. With WSOBP cups, they shoot 10-14, you shoot 2-14. You lose. With solo cups, they shoot 10-10, you shoot 6-10. You still lose! You just lose faster, and were able to clear a little bit more of the table. Thats pretty much a top team vs a casual team situation. Like i said what are the chances of playing multiple top teams in the prelims?? The goal i would think is to make it to day 3 and that would be enough to bring people back.
TheDang Joined: 04.05.2010 Age: 22 Total Games: 207 W/L %: 59.9 Avg CD: 0.53 Full Stats	Posted: Sep 8th 2010, 10:50 am Post subject: Bigger sized cups?? "cjmcka" Randomness benefits the less skilled. Essentially, making a game easier benefits good players more than it benefits poor players. Whereas making the game harder hurts good players more than it hurts poor players. Ex: If you were to make the cups even smaller, say 8 oz cups, even the good players would have a really hard time hitting them, such that making a cup would take a lot more luck. The higher the amount of luck you need, the less skill really comes into play. Hence, a pong game with 8oz cups would put elite and casual players on a more even playing field. (not to say the elites wouldn't still win) So, if you make the cups bigger, you are making the game less random by making it easier, thereby benefiting elite players more than poor or casual players. I like your example alot haha. Thats a good way to put it. Lets make the cups 12 oz cups.. More difficult but still makeable. 8 oz seems really small lol.
Clawless Joined: 04.15.2009 Age: 27 Total Games: 522 W/L %: 61.69 Avg CD: 0.85 Full Stats	Posted: Sep 8th 2010, 06:31 pm Post subject: Bigger sized cups?? Day 3 isn't determined by your win/loss ratio. It's not like if you win 8 games, you make day 3. The top 128 teams make day 3, regardless of how many games they won. If you made the cups bigger, instead of 8-4 being enough to make day 3, you would have to go 11-1, no question.
Strider Joined: 07.16.2007 Age: 25 Total Games: 110 W/L %: 60 Avg CD: 0.67 Full Stats	Posted: Sep 8th 2010, 09:56 pm Post subject: Bigger sized cups?? you guys arent thinking about the fact that there is a level of player in between elite and casual... lets call them pro's, so we have casual, pro, and elite which is obviously the best of the best. pro's are those guys who play in a lot of tournaments but are not quite as good as the elites maybe they just cant come out as much or whatever the reason being they just are not AS good as the casual players. I consider myself in this category, now if you give everyone a bigger target like you said the elites will still be shooting perfect and near perfect games the whole day but now you have just made it easier for the pro's to hit 80-90% of theirs shots instead of their normal 60-70%. Since there are two groups of players now shooting very high numbers instead of just the elites like you suggested before it means that the casual players, whom are already normally outnumbered by pro's and elites (at our tournaments in AZ they are anyway not sure about other places) still getting dominated but now by more teams than they would of if you would of just kept the cups the size they are now. What im trying to say is the argument that they wont have to play against elite teams much anyway throughout the tournament is only true if we are playing with the cups we use now or even with smaller cups, if you make the cups bigger all the teams that are used to playing in our tournaments will seem like elites to the casual players... im still not sure if that makes sense hopefully it does lol
TheDang Joined: 04.05.2010 Age: 22 Total Games: 207 W/L %: 59.9 Avg CD: 0.53 Full Stats	Posted: Sep 9th 2010, 08:52 am Post subject: Bigger sized cups?? "strider" you guys arent thinking about the fact that there is a level of player in between elite and casual... lets call them pro's, so we have casual, pro, and elite which is obviously the best of the best. pro's are those guys who play in a lot of tournaments but are not quite as good as the elites maybe they just cant come out as much or whatever the reason being they just are not AS good as the casual players. I consider myself in this category, now if you give everyone a bigger target like you said the elites will still be shooting perfect and near perfect games the whole day but now you have just made it easier for the pro's to hit 80-90% of theirs shots instead of their normal 60-70%. Since there are two groups of players now shooting very high numbers instead of just the elites like you suggested before it means that the casual players, whom are already normally outnumbered by pro's and elites (at our tournaments in AZ they are anyway not sure about other places) still getting dominated but now by more teams than they would of if you would of just kept the cups the size they are now. What im trying to say is the argument that they wont have to play against elite teams much anyway throughout the tournament is only true if we are playing with the cups we use now or even with smaller cups, if you make the cups bigger all the teams that are used to playing in our tournaments will seem like elites to the casual players... im still not sure if that makes sense hopefully it does lol Haha no that makes sense. Which i guess i never thought about that. I just thought about the casual and elite. Didnt think about in between. I consider myself at the pro level which you are talking about, shooting wise that is, but then again as of right now im a casual player since i dont have alot of tournament experience under my belt. Hope to get to the pro level and hopefully someday the elite level. There seems to be more cons than pros in this situation haha.
BNich16 Joined: 08.04.2010 Age: 24 Total Games: 31 W/L %: 61.29 Avg CD: 0.81 Full Stats	Posted: Sep 9th 2010, 09:54 am Post subject: Bigger sized cups?? "Clawless" Day 3 isn't determined by your win/loss ratio. It's not like if you win 8 games, you make day 3. The top 128 teams make day 3, regardless of how many games they won. If you made the cups bigger, instead of 8-4 being enough to make day 3, you would have to go 11-1, no question. Why would bigger cups make the cutoff line change? Say there's 600 teams. That's 7,200 prelim games. The record in those games HAVE to be 3,600-3,600. Whether the cups are 5oz or 40oz, the records would still be the same.